Post by Martin Doerr (4 September 2024).
Dear All,
I propose the following modifications for P179 and P191, as attached, following issue 665.
Specificity of the "Monetary amount" for a transaction is much more relevant for querying, and unambiguous, than asking for all transactions or things having the same monetary nominal value. Indeed, I cannot grasp the sense of the latter.
Therefore I change the quantifier to one to one, necessary, and enhance the scope note.
Best,
Martin
Proposal by Martin Doerr & Christian-Emil to adjust the FOL statements for P191 had duration and P179 had sales price, to include inferences excluding the use of P43 and (P179|P191) respectively (personal communication: 19 August 2024)
P191 had duration (was duration of) - v7.3
In first-order logic:
- P191(x,y) ⇒ E52(x)
- P191(x,y) ⇒ E54(y)
Exclusion statements for CRMbase:
- P191(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ P43(x,z)]
- P191(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ P179(x,z)]
Exclusion statements for CRMsci to go under O12:
- P191(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ O12(x,z)]
P179 had sales price (was sales price of) -v7.3
In first-order logic:
- P179(x,y) ⇒ E96(x)
- P179(x,y) ⇒ E97(y)
Exclusion statements for CRMbase:
- P179(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ P43(x,z)]
- P179(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ P191(x,z)]
Exclusion statements for CRMsci to go under O12:
- P179(x,y) ⇒ ¬(∃z) [E54(z) ⋀ O12(x,z)]
In the 60th joint meeting of the CIDOC CRM and ISO/TC46/SC4/WG9 & 53rd FRBR/LRMoo SIG, the SIG reviewed the proposal by MD & CEO to adjust the FOL statements, property quantifiers and scope notes for P179 had sales prices (was sales price of) and P191 had duration (was duration of) to exclude unwarranted inferences concerning the kinds of entities the dimensions in question belong to.
Decision: the proposal was approved, except for the exclusion statements (the details of the proposal and the ensuing discussion can be found in the attached document).
N.b.: the exclusion statements proposed for P43, P179, P191 were not part of this discussion
HW: MD, CEO, WS to revise them
HW: WS to start a new issue where he will propose a statement explaining that historical aspects of each documented value (comparisons and whatnots) do not fall within the scope of CIDOC CRM
Bern, April 2025
Post by Christian-Emil Ore (6 October 2025)
- P43 has dimension: change quantification to “one to many (0,n:0,1)”
- P191 had duration: change quantification to “one to one, necessary (1,1:0,1)”
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P179 had sales price: change quantification to “one to one, necessary (1,1:0,1)”
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Provide additional FOL conditions to disallow one instance of E54 Dimension to be the dimension of an E18 Physical Thing and an E96 Purchase, and an E52 Time-Span simultaneously.
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Ο12 has dimension: change quantification to “many to many (0,n:0,n)”
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- Provide additional condition that if a dimension pertains to multiple instances of S15 Observable Entity, then this dimension is an instance of S25 Relative Dimension.
- Assign HW to define a shortcut property (S21 Measurement. Oxx7 observed dimension: E54 Dimension; “one to one, necessary (1,1:0,1)”. The model can generalize to Observation.